Episode 18: We All Have Anxiety
Anxiety is not always a bad thing. It can serve a purpose — but it can also begin to control or change your life. In this episode of South of Fine, we are joined by Right Track Medical Group psychiatrist Dr. Johanna Lu to discuss the ins and outs of anxiety and what to do when it becomes a problem.
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Rhes Low, Host:
Hey, guys. Welcome back to another episode of South of Fine. I, as usual, am your host, Rhes Low. As our regular listeners know, our goal at South of Fine is to change the stigma around mental healthcare. One of the best ways that we can do this is by inviting more people to the conversation in true Southern form. If you want to help our podcast get seen by more people, which I hope you do, we really, really, really hope that you will subscribe to South of Fine. Then you can rate us, and then you can share our episodes with all your friends and family. We'd love that. In the mean time, today we are going to have a conversation with Dr. Johanna Lu, a psychiatrist at Right Track Medical Group.
Low:
Welcome to South of Fine, a podcast from Right Track Medical Group dedicated to stigmatizing mental health in the South through genuine conversation about the challenges that we all face every day. For more information, please visit our website righttrackmedical.com/southoffine. Well, we hope you enjoy listening to our podcast. Please remember that this is not a substitute for professional diagnosis or for the treatment of any mental health condition.
Low:
All right, guys. So, Dr. Lu is joining us today to talk about one of the most common mental health illnesses in the United States, and we have actually probably mentioned this issue on every single show that we've had. It's anxiety. According to the National Alliance on Mental Health, 48 million adults struggle with anxiety each year. Dr. Lu, we're so glad that you're here to discuss this topic with us.
Johanna Lu, psychiatrist:
Thank you. Thank you. I'm very glad to be joining.
Low:
Good. Cool. How's your day?
Lu:
It's been very fruitful.
Low:
Oh. That's good.
Lu:
Yes. Yes.
Low:
I like to hear that. A fruitful day. Yes. That's a good day. Most days should be fruitful if we really think about it.
Lu:
I agree.
Low:
... and put our hearts and minds into it. So, like I said, on this show in the past, every single episode at some point anxiety comes up, especially with the college kids. I know that many people around me in my personal life suffer from anxiety or exacerbated anxiety, so let's start off with exactly what is anxiety and what it isn't, and in that, is there a difference between anxiety and worry?
Lu:
Yes. So, actually, I'm very glad that we started off with that. Again, I wanted to repeat that I'm very glad to be joining today, because this is a very important topic considering that it's very common, and it's also very easily misused. So, one thing that I wanted to stress today is anxiety is not stress. We tend to use those words very commonly and they're very commonly enmeshed. So, with that, anxiety is something also that I also want to normalize it, is that we all have anxiety, and anxiety is very much a part of our lives just as fear is, just as happiness is, and crying and sadness is, because at the end of the day, we're all human and we all have emotions.
Lu:
So, anxiety is a normal reaction to stress. So, as you can see, it's part of stress, but it's not stress. And anxiety is, for example, if right now I'm studying for a test tomorrow, a very, very, very difficult, long test, and I haven't finished studying but it's 10:00 PM and I'm so worried that I cannot finish, and tomorrow is my big day, I will feel anxious, and that is a normal reaction towards whatever is overcoming me and whatever the circumstance is.
Lu:
Now, when it's a problem, anxiety as a disorder per se, is when I cannot shake it, when I'm feeling that anxiety, that heart racing, that nervousness, and it's out of proportion to whatever the stressor is, when I cannot shut it, when I cannot stop thinking about it, when it's controlling me versus when I'm worried, but you know what, let me go to sleep. It's going to be okay tomorrow. That's different. That is worry. Worry is we're thinking about something in particular around our lives that we need to solve, that we want it to get better, something that occupies a space in our minds, but we can't stop it. We can, "Oh, I have to buy milk at Walmart. Let me go to Walmart and buy milk." I can stop. Worry is something it's occupying. I'm stressing about it, but I can stop it. Anxiety as a disorder, you can't.
Low:
That is a brilliant explanation. I love the delineation between anxiety and stress, because to some degree as human beings I would imagine that stress and worry are part of moving us forward.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
And so, basically what you're saying is... This is a hard question because where is that line crossed? You know what I mean?
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Low:
Where does stress cross into... Is it just, like you said, when you can't get rid of it?
Lu:
That's the simplest explanation because truly... Again, we all stress. What is life without stress? Let's be honest here. And every day that passes by, you turn on the news and stress. You hear something, stress, and that causes anxiety. And anxiety on its own can be just a normal reaction to whatever you're hearing or whatever you're thinking, but it doesn't necessarily involve that is a problem. Again, it's your ability, and I think this is the best way that I can describe it, is more of your ability to control it. Can I stop it right now? Can I focus on something else? Can I focus on taking care of my kids? Can I focus on my wife or my husband? Is he saying something important and I am not listening to him because I'm thinking about something else and I'm worried about that? Can I be more present in the moment? That's it. Am I enjoying things? Am I here? Are you here, or are you getting carried away with whatever you're worrying or stressed about and you cannot be in the moment?
Low:
Okay. So, based upon that, my curiosity is to is anxiety always negative? You've delineated between stress and worry, and that is why I wanted to know if anxiety is always negative, because it seems to me that anxiety would be a negative attribute.
Lu:
Thank you. You know that example that I talked about earlier about a test coming up and feeling anxious?
Low:
Yeah.
Lu:
Anxiety is actually a good thing, and I want us to not think that anxiety is so bad and so negative. We all have anxiety for a reason, and when I talk about anxiety, what I mean is that heart racing, your palms sweating, that rush of you wanting to run. It's the physical aspect of it. So, anxiety is protective. We as human beings, let's go back into the before Jesus Christ, before the era and all of that, when we were cavemen we needed something to alert us of danger. We needed something. "Oh my gosh. Run." And what is that? That is heart racing, palms sweating, "Oh my gosh," and you run, and that's anxiety. So, anxiety, it's been always, so I don't want to... It's not a negative. It's more of part of who we are, and we need it.
Low:
Right. Just like anything else, it can overtake us, and that's when it becomes negative.
Lu:
Exactly, when it's controlling us instead of us controlling it.
Low:
Right. Okay. I love how succinctly you put that about if you can't let it go, that's when it's a negative issue.
Lu:
Yes. Yes.
Low:
Okay. So, on a personal level or someone you know, I don't know, I'm sure that you've experienced anxiety.
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Low:
How has that impacted your life, your growth, and maybe some pitfalls? Ultimately, if it did take over a little bit and got into that negative realm, how did you manage that, or how would you help someone that needs to manage that?
Lu:
How has anxiety affected me? That is a very... I have so many examples, but truly the one that-
Low:
Me too.
Lu:
And more so because of the field that I'm at, as a psychiatrist, that's where you see every day, and because anxiety is so common, it's our daily thing. From 10 patients I see, nine have anxiety in one way, shape, or form. Going back to before I was a psychiatrist, I didn't even realize it was anxiety. It was all those little moments where that gut-wrenching feeling... Something that probably you don't know about me is that I'm a mom. I'm married, happily married. I've been with my husband since forever, and I'm a mom. And before that part of my personality and who I am, it's more of like I want to achieve things. I set a goal. I am very structured in that way, so when I talk about tests it's because if I had a test, I had to study, I had to study. That's how my brain has been since day one.
Low:
Do you still have those dreams from medical school or college?
Lu:
Yes. Oh my gosh.
Low:
Had a few of those the other day.
Lu:
Oh my goodness. As if I'm there. Oh my gosh. How many times now we dreamt that we're taking the test and you're not ready. Oh my gosh. That was my go-to. So, anxiety has always been there for me and it drives me, and I'm thankful for it because exactly that. "Oh my gosh. I have a test tomorrow," and I would prepare or probably overprepare for that because of that uncomfortable feeling that I was feeling, that racing, my heart racing or that worry.
Lu:
But I think more personally, I think when I had my son, when I had my first child, it was... I cannot explain you. People tell you all the time, "Hey, when you have a kid, it changes your life," and you're like, "Oh, wow. Yes, of course. My love and all of it." It's so exciting, and you're so excited. And don't get me wrong, it is, but no one prepares you for the daily every minute every day kind of change. When I had my first child I was in residency, meaning I was training to be a psychiatrist. We lived in New York City in Manhattan, and I worked in The Bronx, just so you have an idea. It was, oh my god, like a 50-minute commute in the subway.
Low:
That's hard.
Lu:
Very. Very hard. So, it would take me a long time to get to work, come back, and have a baby. And through all of that, I am worried, my kid, and I have to be on time to pick him up from daycare because if not, then daycare would call the... Oh my goodness. If you don't get to pick up your son or daughter, whoever, at the time that they close, obviously, it's a concern, but they would probably call EMS on you, on the kid, and take him to a hospital. I'm like, "No, no, no." Only the idea of it just caused anxiety.
Lu:
So, every day of my life whenever I had to pick up my son, it was so anxiety-provoking. "Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god. Am I going to get home? Am I going to have to finish this? Oh my gosh. This patient is taking too long and I feel so sorry, and the patient is crying, but I have to pick up my kid." And that experience, it was just so draining, and every time I got home I was already physically and emotionally drained.
Lu:
So, how did I get out of that? First of all, I realized, "Something's happening. I'm changing. I'm becoming more irritated. I'm not present." As I said earlier, "I'm not here. I'm worried. I did make it on time, but tomorrow I'm going to have to do this, this, this, this, this." By the way, nothing happened. I never was late. I was always on time.
Low:
Wow. That's actually very impressive.
Lu:
I was always on time. It was just me working myself up to, "What if something happens?"
Low:
What if? Yeah.
Lu:
Yeah. All of the what ifs, all of the worries of things that I couldn't control, I tried to control and I couldn't. When I realized I wasn't enjoying those times when I was with my son because I was worried about the next day, I figured, "Okay. Something's wrong." So, the first thing that we need to do is acknowledge. Sometimes it's someone else notices it, but it's more important you noticing it in yourself like, "I'm changing. Oh my goodness. I'm becoming this. I'm changing." So, the way that I worked through it is more of I started to let go. I started to have to learn to let go of part of that thing that I wanted to control, which was time. You cannot control time, unfortunately.
Low:
But still, I imagine that was very difficult for you.
Lu:
Yes, yes, yes. It was talking it out with my husband. It was me also trying to soothe myself really on my way to the train. Those 50 minutes in the train, it was listening to music, doing things that I enjoy so I could take my mind out of, "Oh my gosh. I cannot control it. Oh my gosh. My time, my time, my time." Also, if that failed, then I recurred to, "Okay. Did I do everything that I could? Yes I did. Am I really that late? No, I'm not." Me self-soothing myself, which it's something very important is our ability to calm ourselves down. And then, finally asking for help. In that specific scenario it was, "Hey, husband. Do you mind today picking him up because, I don't know, today my patient is taking a little bit longer. Can you pick him up?" And that just made a huge difference. It was just that support. Yes.
Low:
That's a big step, asking for help.
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). It is. Sometimes we don't want to or sometimes we think we're very self-sufficient. We are not.
Low:
Do you think that it's harder for people that are, and I say this in the best sense of the word, like you, more controlling? You like your time to be controlled. You like to be organized. Is it harder to ask for help, or is it easier to ask for help in that situation?
Lu:
I think you know the answer to that. It's harder. Sometimes we think we're supermen and superwomen, and we don't realize that we're overdoing it, when in fact, just reaching out for a hand would be so much easier. I don't know what we want to prove. I don't know what we want to... What are we trying to prove to ourselves? That we can? We already proved it. There's no goal. There's no medal that we receive because we were on time. Well, no. Wait a second. If we're talking about work, yes, yes, yes, but you know what I'm saying. There's certain things that worry us just because we think that that's what it's supposed to be, so we overdo it. And there's no goal. No one told you, "This is how it's supposed to do." You added that extra stress.
Low:
Yeah. So, you kind of mentioned within that story a few things that you did to manage your anxiety on a day-to-day basis. Asking for help, telling yourself to physically calm down, a few others, and maybe you could mention those again after I ask this. Do breathing techniques work?
Lu:
Okay. Well, they do. Short answer, yes. The truth is that whatever causes anxiety and then leads to panic attacks and leads to something else and something else is us freaking out. The baseline of us is us, "Oh my god. Oh my god. I cannot. I cannot. I'm losing control. I'm losing control." And it goes further, further, further, deeper into it. And it starts with one thing, us breathing. Our heart starts racing. We start sweating. We start freaking out, but our breathing starts, "Oh my god," with it. And when we do that, then it creates this roller coaster of symptoms that doesn't stop.
Lu:
Now, breathing techniques, they really work. They help slow down that roller coaster. So, if you start noticing that you're shallow breathing or whatever, or you're not even going there. The physical symptoms are not there. It's just your worries. You're worried, worried, worried, and you start breathing, it helps soothe. By breathing slower actually helps slow down and recenter your thoughts. That's the whole point.
Lu:
Now, if you know how to do it correctly, of course it works better, but not everyone does it appropriately, because if you start breathing slower but shallow, then you're defeating the purpose. And the reason why slow breathing, and I quote it, works is because it refocuses that thought. It makes you think about your breathing. You're focused on, "Just breathe. Just breathe," and you're focused on your breathing alone versus whatever is going on that is worrying you and stressing you and causing the anxiety.
Low:
Yeah. I completely believe in that. Coming from an acting background, there are plenty of breathing techniques and breathing things that we do that's kind of a meditation type thing. I don't want to get into all that, but it relieves stresses in your body. And a lot of times in our day-to-day we forget to breathe.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
I notice myself doing it all the time. I have to physically say, "Wait a minute. Just breathe a little bit."
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Yeah.
Low:
It's very, very interesting. So, I'm glad that that does work, and I'm glad that we have to breathe to live.
Lu:
That is also true.
Low:
It's an easy thing to help manage anxiety.
Lu:
Everyone has that tool.
Low:
Yes. Right. That's right. That's right. Just breathe.
Lu:
Yes. Just take it slow.
Low:
Okay, so along those lines, speaking of everybody has a body... That doesn't make any sense. I was trying to segue into how anxiety affects the physical health of your body. I wanted to ask that at the very beginning, but I imagine it has some pretty profound effects. Is that correct?
Lu:
Oh, yes. Yes, yes, yes. So, when I mentioned in the beginning anxiety is not stress but it is related... Stress, we all know what that is. We all have heard what is the stress hormone, so all of us have in our bodies a hormone that actually we secrete normally and when we're stressed, obviously, that's why we call it stress hormone. So, that hormone is helpful in some situations, but when we secrete a lot of that, then it causes issues such as it decreases... When we're very stressed, meaning anxious, and we don't know how to calm ourself down, the stress hormone increases, and the stress hormone, when it's too much for you, it decreases your ability to use your sugars in the body. So, it can increase your intolerance for sugar, so somewhat like a diabetes. But this is years in making. This is a lot of stress, a lot of stress, a lot of stress.
Low:
Oh, okay.
Lu:
Yes. Heart racing, we've talked about that so many times, and when your heart races... Obviously, if you do have a heart racing all the time and palpitations... Before I say that, let me be clear. When we feel that we're having a heart attack because of a panic attack, you're not. You're not. You're not going to die out of it. Let me just say that. You're not going to die when you're having a panic attack. Trust me. But, the long term effects of having untreated anxiety is that it truly overall can increase your blood pressure. The stress level. The stress hormone increases your blood pressure, can increase your blood sugars, it can give you digestive issues. We've all heard of IBS, irritable bowel syndrome, and how when we started noticing, "There's a lot of people having these issues where they go to the bathroom all the time when they're nervous. What is it?" we actually linked it to anxiety. Anxiety makes-
Low:
Really?
Lu:
Yes. Irritable bowel syndrome is caused... Well, not directly caused, but it is worsened by anxiety when we're nervous, when we're anxious, when we're worried, when we have a big test, then we go to the bathroom a lot.
Low:
This is a rabbit hole, and let me... I don't want to go down it, but let me ask this question because I'm very curious. When I was a child, let's say the '80s, I never heard of IBS.
Lu:
Yep. Me neither.
Low:
I never heard anything about it.
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Low:
So, in the '90s and 2000s is when you heard IBS, and there are certain stressors that are very consistent and constant in our lives in modern day.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
This is not a very medical question. Sorry.
Lu:
It's okay.
Low:
Could it be attributed to more stressors being invited into our lives on a daily basis, minute by minute?
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
We'll take that with a little bit of a grain of salt there.
Lu:
Yeah. Thank you. The truth is, you're right, in the '80s you never heard of IBS. That was something trending 2000s. Now, we know more about it, yes. Now we've studied it, now we know how to treat it. In the beginning, we never knew. It was just a constellation of symptoms. It didn't have a term. And why are we hearing it so much now? Now, five out of 10 to 15 people could have IBS. And in the past, the '80s, no one had it. I don't know if no one had it. I do know that with time things have been more complicated, things have been more... You said rabbit hole and I'm getting in there. Sorry.
Low:
I'm so sorry.
Lu:
But social media, that impact, that extra stress, that extra added layer of pressure that we are adding to ourselves, it's just a question mark. Does that add to us having more physical symptoms?
Low:
Yeah. I guess, yes.
Lu:
Yes. Yep. Because, what was the difference in the '80s? In the '80s, you turn on the TV and music and that's it, and you played with your friends outside and video games, but we didn't have internet. Did I have internet at that time? I don't remember.
Low:
No. I didn't.
Lu:
No. Me neither. So, we didn't have internet, so we didn't have a platform where you can socialize with other people at the same time for a long time until social media hit, so it adds to a problem. Yes.
Low:
I think I mentioned this before too. What we used to do is go to our bedroom and, like you said, listen to music, which is soothing, some of it. But it's not constant drama when you're in middle school or when you're in fifth or sixth grade. It's enjoying your time alone.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
So, let's just cut that right there, rabbit hole, and then we'll... But you're so articulate, and you're able to put things so people like me who are laymen can understand them, so it just inspires a lot of thought. That's awesome. I imagine you're a wonderful psychiatrist.
Lu:
Oh, thank you so much. I don't know. I'm not the best at receiving compliment, but thank you.
Low:
We all have to get there at some point. As long as you just feel them.
Lu:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). True.
Low:
So, if you're not controlling your anxiety, do you always need to seek professional help?
Lu:
As a psychiatrist, that is what I do every day, is mental health and how important it is. I can tell you, even if you're not anxious, I highly recommend always seeking therapy. Verbal therapy, psychotherapy, always helps. You don't need to suffer from anxiety to do that. We had a difficult mom and I had trauma because of it, or she was so demanding and I... Which is not the case, Mom. Just in case.
Low:
Dr. Lu, we're not talking about your mom. I promise. Dr. Lu's mom, we are not talking about you.
Lu:
No, no, no, Mom. No, no, no. But we all have issues. That friend that didn't speak to me correctly and I couldn't let it go, was it me? All those little things. You always want that extra layer of someone that it's just there to guide you along the way. Impartial, because if you go to your mom, if you go to dad, if you go to husband, if you go to wife, whatever, there will be some partial aspect of it when they give you an advice, so it's always very helpful.
Lu:
Now, anxiety-wise, yes, when you start noticing that it starts controlling you, again, when you cannot control it, and I think this is very when you cannot be present in the moment. Yeah, yeah, but how many times are we present in the moment on a daily basis? As you said, how many times do you forget to breathe, take a breath in your daily basis, and it doesn't necessarily mean that you are anxious all the time. It just means that we all get caught up in life and the daily living. But when we start having difficulties with it, when we start noticing, "You know what? It takes so long for me to get to work because I had a panic attack. I got late to work. I cannot focus. I'm behind. I didn't complete my project on time. I didn't meet my quota because I couldn't concentrate. I forget to complete that paperwork," when it starts interfering with your functioning, with the way that you function in life, that's when you need to seek help as soon as possible.
Low:
Great. And I think that's across the board in any of these issues, which is why it's so important to have a good support system, I would imagine. And for those people that don't, please, like Dr. Lu said, reach out for help-
Lu:
Please.
Low:
... to a friend or a neighbor, anybody, if you don't have that support system. So, speaking of, how can people be a good support for friends or family members that are dealing with anxiety?
Lu:
First of all, I think something that we need to know is that support for... We're social. All of us human beings, even if you say, "No. I like to stay at home a lot and not interact a lot," we are human beings that are social by nature. So, our nature is communicating. It's feeling that connection with someone. So, knowing that, studies show that the more support you have from family, from friends, it doesn't matter where it comes from, it actually buffers the effects and your levels of anxiety. So, this is for that person that is hearing this that has a friend that probably struggles with anxiety but has never mentioned it. It's not necessarily for that person that struggles with anxiety. It's for those also that, "What can I do about it?" for that friend or family. And one of those is just being there. It's reaching out to that person. "You're not alone." That's a powerful thing. "You're not alone. I'm here. I'm here to hear what are you worried about." Literally, support, being there to support that person.
Lu:
But also the other way that we can help as friends or family members is literally keeping them busy, keeping them out of their mind like, "Hey, let's watch a movie. Hey, look at this," always within the safety, always COVID and all of that. It's just providing that emotional support and connection. Yes, providing advice, but keeping them busy, keeping them out of that mindset, "I'm worried. I'm anxious." "Let's watch a movie. Oh my goodness. Hear this podcast."
Low:
Yeah. Don't listen to the guy talking, but listen to the woman talking. No. I'm good at this because I'm very aware of all of my problems and issues, and I'm very curious about them. Awareness. Awareness, support, reaching out to others too. I like that you said that. Call somebody. Say, if you think they're alone, "You're not alone." I would imagine that's a good stress reliever too actually, looking out for others.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
So, as we wrap this up, I just want you to... If you have any final thoughts or anything on anxiety or on anything, honestly, I'd love to hear them.
Lu:
Well, it's very important for us to reach out. Don't wait if you feel like you're not doing that well. I'm saying this because of the era we're living right now. I think all of those changes that are going on, something that is important to know is what are we living right now. It's this era of COVID-19, this isolation brought upon. It was forced upon us because the only way that we could beat this is by doing that. Yes, sure, but if we would have a choice we would probably wanted to live our lives that we were living last year before we knew that COVID existed.
Lu:
So, COVID just brought up a lot of reminding us what is important to us. We always took for granted that ability that we had to go to the restaurant and eat, that ability we had to go see our parents, visit our family members, visit our friends, spend time, and with that, it brought a lot of fears, it brought a lot of worry. "What is going to happen? Are we going to be okay? Is so-and-so going to recover?" So, all of this has opened that humanity in us, I guess, reminding us, "Wait a second. We're not invincible. There's so many things in life that we don't have control of." So, it increased the anxiety in us, and people that never had anxiety started developing anxiety, by the way.
Lu:
So, I think my message is it's okay. We're all going through this, and anxiety is part of us. Don't run away from it in the sense of, "Oh my god. Oh my god. This is horrible." Yes, it's bad. Seek help. Ask someone. "Let me see if this is so bad as I think it is," or, "You know what, it's not as bad." And we... How can I say this? We have things for free in life that help us on a daily basis to go back to being happy or enjoying life. The breathing exercises that we talked about, breathing works. It's free. We do it every day. We have to. So, it works. Exercising. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we don't have time, and yeah, who likes to exercise? Not everyone likes to, but it does help. And I don't want to be sounding like a broken record, that doctor that says the same thing over and over. "Diet and exercise." Well, it is important. It is. And it works, and it's something that you can control.
Lu:
Anxiety is caused by lack of control, so in this times, we were knocked in the head or slapped in the face, reminded, "You don't have control." That's what happened. And regaining part of that control and letting go of it and saying, "You know what, yes. I don't have control over what goes on in the world with COVID right now, but what I do have control is what goes on with me." Very important. "I have control over what time I'm going to go to sleep. I have control over what I'm going to feed my kids, what I'm going to watch. I'm going to watch this move I wanted to watch all this time. I am going to do it." Just be here. Just be present and enjoy, and then reach out for help when it's out of your control. That's it.
Low:
You make it sound so easy.
Lu:
No. I know it's not.
Low:
I know. I know. I know. And I don't think that you think that it's easy, but excellent, excellent insight into the whole gamut of anxiety, understanding what it is exactly and understanding how to manage it. It's such an important topic, like you said, in this current environment. I keep saying that eating and exercising... As a person that's been in both places, it does. It makes a huge difference. I'm smarter when I eat healthy and I exercise.
Lu:
I know. You have more energy.
Low:
I can breathe. Yeah.
Lu:
Yes.
Low:
I can play with my kids.
Lu:
Yes, yes, yes.
Low:
Well, Dr. Lu, it's been an extreme pleasure. I do hope that we have you back some time very soon, and as I said, your patients are very lucky to have you. So, thank you so much again for being here.
Lu:
Thank you. Thank you for having me, and I'm looking forward to coming back.
Low:
Awesome. Very cool. All right. Have a good weekend, actually. It's almost the weekend.
Lu:
Oh my goodness. No, it's not. It's the middle of-
Low:
Two days.
Lu:
That's true.
Low:
See. I'm a very cup-
Lu:
Cup full.
Low:
Half full. Yeah. Not half empty.
Lu:
I'm half empty. Okay.
Low:
So is my wife. It's all right.
Lu:
Bye. Nice to meet you.
Low:
Bye.
Lu:
Bye.
Low:
If you have questions about mental health and the COVID-19 pandemic that you'd like our providers to answer in a future episode, please email southoffine@righttrackmedical.com, and if you'd like more information about Right Track Medical Group or the South of Fine podcast, please visit righttrackmedical.com. Thanks to our production team, Kelley Hunsberger, Caitlyn Clegg, Carol Ann Hughes, Aleka Battista, and Rhes Low. Special thanks to Squadcast for providing superior remote interview services.
Continue Listening
Past Episodes
Explore our resources
